Attention all Mfesters....IMPORTANT

[LateBraking]

Originally Posted by RPIpower

lol, I warned everyone about those fools.

I got caught with them early on. I also bailed ship early on. Lessons learned.

[RPIpower]

Originally Posted by Jajima

I got caught with them early on. I also bailed ship early on. Lessons learned.

There are always scumbags like that in the industry. They were customers of ours, then they copied our scoops and told people they made them. lol. There are tons of other companies that copied us with that. Oh well. If you ever have questions about stuff like that, hit me up. Ill always tell you like it is. Good thing you bailed early on. There are a lot of guys that got screwed big time by rr.

[Nathan@CandCcollision.com]

Originally Posted by constantin

Several people have said this. ^

This is not directed at the vendors above, but sometimes you don't want to go back to the original vendor. I've had problems with businesses that screwed up and tried to fix the problem and in the process only making things worse.

I get what you're saying and it makes sense to cut your losses especially when the company/person you are dealing with proves to be completely incompetent. However in this case I think it goes without saying that ESS and/or RPI are reputable companies that you do not need to worry about. The law also supports that you allow the shop to rectify the problem before they would make a judgement against them.

[Asbjorn@ESS]

Amir,

Facts :

1. You approached us with a car programmed with another vendors software that according to yourself had a significant power dip in the mid-range. You wanted to purchase the ESS software if you could test it out on the track first.

2. We backed up your existing software and loaded the ESS software. We also erased adaptations as both individual cylinder timing adaptation as well as the general ROZ adaptation was at maximum retard when car came to me. I also loaded ESS DCT performance software at the same time.

3. You drove this ESS ECU/DCT combination for several laps around the track and came back in stating the car felt quicker and more responsive, but you were not sure if it was the transmission or engine control software that made the difference. I told you it is a combination of both. There was no CEL or codes after track testing. You then asked me if you could test both the ECU and DCT software for a few more weeks before deciding and I told you that would not be possible without payment. You then stated you did not have any credit cards or cash on you and that I would have to put your car back to previous state for the time being. You would then visit RPI and have the software installed with them at a later time.

4. I reflashed DCT computer back to factory BMW spec as per your instructions.

5. I warned you against reinstalling your previous ECU tune since all ignition adaptations was maxed out downwards on your 91 octane fuel. This means the ECU can not pull more timing out even if required and I do not recommend that you run it on 91 pump as a slightly bad tank of gas is all you need to cause severe engine damage. I recommended that I reinstall stock BMW software for the time being as this would be the safe alternative since my professional opinion was that your previous tune was specified for 93 or higher octane fuel judging from the timing retardation present when the car came in. You refused to and wanted previous tune reinstalled, I did so but also warned you that you had to drive the car extremely soft until the now reset ignition timing adaptations had time to adapt back down to bottom to avoid problems. I guarantee 100% that the EXACT same file you arrived with was reloaded to your car, and if you want me to I can email you a copy of it for reference. I checked every system before you left and you had no codes, no CEL and car operated perfectly normal. If a CEL or increased emssions warning is thrown after a while and there is no generic OBD2 codes thrown it can be due to several things, most likely excessive knock the engine is not able to control or bug in the torque control system/filling adaptation software configuration. Most likely this would have gone away if you had let the ECU adapt fully. It is hard for me to say what threw your CEL after a while as I have not investigated the software you wanted me to reload against my advice. I do know sporadic CEL's and limp modes are often reported on various forums with similar software, especially when it is recently loaded and has not adapted fully. If you had contacted us I would have been happy to set your ECU back to 100% factory and clear any codes, set or pending for no charge. Since the ECU was fully operational, without codes, completed self test, ran engine and communicated with another vendors programming interface later that day when they programmed it, the problem following that is not really on me. If you had called me and explained the situation I would have been more than happy to come out and fix it for you even if it was not me who programmed your ECU last. I have ECU recovery and diagnostic tools the dealership does not have. I would have been able to recover any erroneous programming attempts or ECU RSA/checksum issues without problems, guaranteed.

[endofanera7]

Originally Posted by Asbjorn@ESS

Amir,

Facts :

1. You approached us with a car programmed with another vendors software that according to yourself had a significant power dip in the mid-range. You wanted to purchase the ESS software if you could test it out on the track first.

2. We backed up your existing software and loaded the ESS software. We also erased adaptations as both individual cylinder timing adaptation as well as the general ROZ adaptation was at maximum retard when car came to me. I also loaded ESS DCT performance software at the same time.

3. You drove this ESS ECU/DCT combination for several laps around the track and came back in stating the car felt quicker and more responsive, but you were not sure if it was the transmission or engine control software that made the difference. I told you it is a combination of both. There was no CEL or codes after track testing. You then asked me if you could test both the ECU and DCT software for a few more weeks before deciding and I told you that would not be possible without payment. You then stated you did not have any credit cards or cash on you and that I would have to put your car back to previous state for the time being. You would then visit RPI and have the software installed with them at a later time.

4. I reflashed DCT computer back to factory BMW spec as per your instructions.

5. I warned you against reinstalling your previous ECU tune since all ignition adaptations was maxed out downwards on your 91 octane fuel. This means the ECU can not pull more timing out even if required and I do not recommend that you run it on 91 pump as a slightly bad tank of gas is all you need to cause severe engine damage. I recommended that I reinstall stock BMW software for the time being as this would be the safe alternative since my professional opinion was that your previous tune was specified for 93 or higher octane fuel judging from the timing retardation present when the car came in. You refused to and wanted previous tune reinstalled, I did so but also warned you that you had to drive the car extremely soft until the now reset ignition timing adaptations had time to adapt back down to bottom to avoid problems. I guarantee 100% that the EXACT same file you arrived with was reloaded to your car, and if you want me to I can email you a copy of it for reference. I checked every system before you left and you had no codes, no CEL and car operated perfectly normal. If a CEL or increased emssions warning is thrown after a while and there is no generic OBD2 codes thrown it can be due to several things, most likely excessive knock the engine is not able to control or bug in the torque control system/filling adaptation software configuration. Most likely this would have gone away if you had let the ECU adapt fully. It is hard for me to say what threw your CEL after a while as I have not investigated the software you wanted me to reload against my advice. I do know sporadic CEL's and limp modes are often reported on various forums with similar software, especially when it is recently loaded and has not adapted fully. If you had contacted us I would have been happy to set your ECU back to 100% factory and clear any codes, set or pending for no charge. Since the ECU was fully operational, without codes, completed self test, ran engine and communicated with another vendors programming interface later that day when they programmed it, the problem following that is not really on me. If you had called me and explained the situation I would have been more than happy to come out and fix it for you even if it was not me who programmed your ECU last. I have ECU recovery and diagnostic tools the dealership does not have. I would have been able to recover any erroneous programming attempts or ECU RSA/checksum issues without problems, guaranteed.

Thank you for chiming in on this situation. It's always good to hear both side of the story. I hope you guys get everything sorted out.

The post is extremely informative and educational, it really helps me understand how tuning on the S65 works!

[RPIpower]

Maybe too much?

[Geoff.T]

Were any of you guys using a battery charger to keep the voltage consistent during all the programming of his car? Not using one is a good way to kill an ECU. A tuner killed my old ECU that way during a software upload. At my work I use a Deutronic battery charger anytime I do any programming to a BMW. I've never had an issue.


I understand you guys are trying to blame bad tunes and what not but it seem like you guys missed a fundamental step.

[constantin]

Originally Posted by Geoff.T

Were any of you guys using a battery charger to keep the voltage consistent during all the programming of his car? Not using one is a good way to kill an ECU. A tuner killed my old ECU that way during a software upload. At my work I use a Deutronic battery charger anytime I do any programming to a BMW. I've never had an issue.


I understand you guys are trying to blame bad tunes and what not but it seem like you guys missed a fundamental step.

Never knew this. From what I've seen, not one tuner has done that.

Can anyone verify this?

[Audio City]

this thread is getting really interesting

[Geoff.T]

Originally Posted by constantin

Never knew this. From what I've seen, not one tuner has done that.

Can anyone verify this?

Lets put it this way, any factory ecu update requires that the battery voltage has to remain above 12v or 13v. I can't remember which it was. Any good BMW diagnostic tool requires this condition and will not let programming occur until this condition is met. Its very possible that in the amount of time it takes to upload new software the voltage can drop from ideal conditions due to the excessive draws all the other units that come on when the key is in the "number 2" position.

Do any tuners have any fail safes in their programming software like that of BMWs?